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Acheron
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is this guy acheron???????? hahaha acheron you big fag

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.. then let's do this thing.

CNN has just projected that Barack Obama is the winner of the Democratic Nomination.

Yes, I have been a Hillary Clinton supporter. I think she is the best candidate for the job, with the added bonus of winning the popular vote of the democratic nomination process.

But this doesn't mean I don't like Barack Obama, I just thought she was the stronger candidate. Since she isn't the candidate, I'm going to give Barack Obama my full support.

I'm going back to southwestern Virginia, a place that has a love affair with the Clintons, and I'm going to have to explain to people that voting for McCain because they're bitter about Clinton losing is choosing petty and selfish politics over the future of the country - especially since Clinton and Obama are in agreement on virtually every issue.

So I raise a single malt to Hillary Clinton, the woman who has at the point of writing this won more votes in a primary election than any other candidate in history, Barack Obama included (even if you don't count Michigan.)

But I'm a Democrat. I don't get bitter, I MoveOn. Let's make it happen, people.

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

This reply was last edited on 06-03-08 06:58:36 PM by Acheron.

Amphytrite
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I don't really even like hearing about it or reading about it

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Si se puede or some bullshit like that. itt you and ice have a lovefest.

‹mmac› do you ever have time to sit back and revel in your coolness?

‹Spiff› Carol experienced a Helvetica Scenario at 2:00 minutes into the video.

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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Quote:
with the added bonus of winning the popular vote of the democratic nomination process.

please defend this lie with facts not quoted from Clinton's website thx

Ztolk
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I heard that in a riding in a black part of New York they counted not one vote for Obama, which is kind of sketchy.

I have a question about the American electoral system in general. Before the election all the republicans vote for the republican candidate and all the democrats vote for the democratic candidate, right? That means that everybody knows which party they're voting for already. Why don't they just see which party has more people vote in it to decide the leader, and make that party the president's party? I'm not sure I'm explaining myself clearly, so I'll switch to numbers.

Democrats: 5000000 people vote for Obama, 4000000 vote for Hillary.
Republicans: 8000000 people vote for McCain, 3000000 people vote for Ron Paul.
Republicans: 11 million. Democrats: 9 million.
So why not just give the presidency to the republicans after that happens?

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I just added up the primary vote counts that are listed on cnn.com

Clinton: 17,038,457
Obama: 16,453,280

So there may be some basis to that claim, ice.

Acheron
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Quoted from Sandamnit:
I just added up the primary vote counts that are listed on cnn.com

Clinton: 17,038,457
Obama: 16,453,280

So there may be some basis to that claim, ice.

CNN is talking about it right now. Or they were.

I still like her, but the process that the democrats have selected him.

I don't think it's been a fair process but I am more interested in having a democrat in the White House than in dividing the party over petty issues like who won the popular vote.

That's not how the system works. That's how it should work.

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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gotta get that VICTORY ROYALE #gamer #memes #LoL

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So you guys aren't including caucuses, or what?

Edit: There are a lot of different ways of counting the popular vote, but I'm sure those numbers are leaving states out. Here's an article that supports this:

http://www.newyorker.com/talk/comment/2008/06/02/080602taco_talk_hertzberg

OK, found some real solid numbers:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/democratic_vote_count.html

Here's a quote from DailyKos:

Quote:
Ultimately, bottom line, Obama wins the popular vote when including the caucus states (which should be obviously done), and either excluding Michigan or giving its uncommitted votes to Obama. (The proper count, as agreed to by the Michigan Democratic Party itself, was the exclude the results as unrepresentative of anything.)

source

This reply was last edited on 06-03-08 07:34:45 PM by Guy Tuttle and Ass.

Angus

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I hope McCain wins because I only like white males.

Acheron
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If I die in Raleigh, at least I will die free.

is this guy acheron???????? hahaha acheron you big fag

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The fairest vote count, including the caucusess, is the one that gives obama the uncomitted from Michigan.

These are the numbers the website you quoted gives:
17,656,697 48.0%: Obama
17,729,790 48.2% Clinton

Regardless, Obama is the nominee.

He has my support.

I would like to discourage further bickering because it will only succeed in dividing us and sabotaging Obama's chance for the presidency.

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

This reply was last edited on 06-03-08 07:55:29 PM by Acheron.

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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Quoted from Acheron:
The fairest vote count, including the caucusess, is the one that gives obama the uncomitted from Michigan.

These are the numbers the website you quoted gives:
17,656,697 48.0%: Obama
17,729,790 48.2% Clinton

No, you read it wrong, these are the numbers, including the caucuses and giving Obama the uncommitted votes

Quote:
Obama 18,067,978 48.1%
Clinton 18,013,981 47.9%

Net: Obama +53,997 +0.2%

You know actually upon examination I can't even find the numbers you gave on the website. Where are they?

Pertti Susilainen
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Quote:
I would like to discourage further bickering because it will only succeed in dividing us and sabotaging Obama's chance for the presidency.

I doubt your arguing in this thread will have any effect whatsoever, don't worry, pal.

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Snowy
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Quoted from ice:
Quoted from Acheron:
The fairest vote count, including the caucusess, is the one that gives obama the uncomitted from Michigan.

These are the numbers the website you quoted gives:
17,656,697 48.0%: Obama
17,729,790 48.2% Clinton

No, you read it wrong, these are the numbers, including the caucuses and giving Obama the uncommitted votes

Quote:
Obama 18,067,978 48.1%
Clinton 18,013,981 47.9%

Net: Obama +53,997 +0.2%

You know actually upon examination I can't even find the numbers you gave on the website. Where are they?

i wish id given you +k for this post instead of that other one MAGUSMAGUSMAGUSMAGUS

enough of that

atlas sighed (at me)
User is currently banned until further notice.

Quote:
I would like to discourage further bickering because it will only succeed in dividing us and sabotaging Obama's chance for the presidency.

i can just barely contain myself; yet another racist candidate inside the white house

Acheron
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If I die in Raleigh, at least I will die free.

is this guy acheron???????? hahaha acheron you big fag

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Quoted from ice:
Quoted from Acheron:
The fairest vote count, including the caucusess, is the one that gives obama the uncomitted from Michigan.

These are the numbers the website you quoted gives:
17,656,697 48.0%: Obama
17,729,790 48.2% Clinton

No, you read it wrong, these are the numbers, including the caucuses and giving Obama the uncommitted votes

Quote:
Obama 18,067,978 48.1%
Clinton 18,013,981 47.9%

Net: Obama +53,997 +0.2%

You know actually upon examination I can't even find the numbers you gave on the website. Where are they?

The numbers are from realclearpolitics. They are in blue. I may be misreading it but they're similar to the numbers quoted to me from CNN last night.

We need to make some changes before next year. First, no more caucuses. The secret ballot removes cultural pressure and is necessary to an effective democracy.

Quoted from Sukkit:
Quote:
I would like to discourage further bickering because it will only succeed in dividing us and sabotaging Obama's chance for the presidency.

I doubt your arguing in this thread will have any effect whatsoever, don't worry, pal.

I'll make the same arguments here I make in the real world, pal.

Just because this is the internet doesn't mean it doesn't matter at all. Party unity is the biggest worry right now and we need to discourage defectors.

I am hoping that the bickering can end now, on-ine and in the real world, for the sake of the Obama presidency.

VISUAL AID SINCE ICE CANT FIND THE NUMBERS AT THE TOP OF A CHART WITH A "CLOSE" EXAMINATION:

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

This reply was last edited on 06-04-08 02:09:16 PM by Acheron.

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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Acheron
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If I die in Raleigh, at least I will die free.

is this guy acheron???????? hahaha acheron you big fag

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Quoted from Acheron:
I may be misreading it but they're similar to the numbers quoted to me from CNN last night.

Look you asked where I got it. It's really a moot point now.

Way to focus on a single line of my post and hijack my attempt at reconciliation.

What the hell are you, a closet McCain supporter?

They paying you money to spread discord on teh internets as some kind of viral marketer?

I offer the olive leaf here and I get a bullshit angry response. It's people acting like you who are going to tear this party apart and ruin our chance at a democratic president.

Grow the hell up.

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

Pertti Susilainen
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Wow, you do take this quite seriously, don't you.

Ice, you'd better stop, or you will be to blame for the defeat of the democrats in the upcoming elections.

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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obama might lose the critical intl swing vote if we keep clarifying how hillary lost the popular vote

D
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haha yeah, are you seriously worried about this convo will spoil your candidate's chances?

Acheron
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Ok, I get the point. Yeah, I know nobody takes INTL seriously, but I'm not worried about INTL. I'm worried about how you, Ice, will treat clinton supporters that you meet out there in the real world. I know a lot of people who support Obama who aren't that bright. We have the same variety of idiot who supported Clinton, too, and who is seriously considering selling out to McCain.

This isn't about this convo. This is about the larger discussion. I don't really mind whatever Ice says here, on INTL. I mind whether he will make the same sort of comments to people in the wider world, because he risks alienating some of the idiots, and I want Obama to not just win, but sweep the nation.

Does that make sense?

By the way, counting this morning's numbers, Obama took a more than 100,000 vote lead, so whatever numbers we were counting before don't matter. He now has won the popular vote.

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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Listen man, I was only getting on your case because you were repeating Hillary's lies.

Plus I'm from California, he's gonna win this state so hard it doesn't matter what the fuck I do, I could campaign for McCain every day until November and it wouldn't make a difference.

Acheron
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is this guy acheron???????? hahaha acheron you big fag

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You make some very good points, Ice.

I have to go back to Virginia though and convince a bunch of peckerwoods to vote for a black guy. Racism and sexism are both very much alive, though, and I'm going to need all the help I can get.

I'm VP of the Young Dems at my school, and I've already started getting people in line to handle a few reactionaries who are angry about the media and a number of other issues, which by the way led to some things being unfair for Obama, too. The point is that while I like Hillary, I really like Obama too, and I'm going to fight hard for him and with the same enthusiasm with which I fought for Hillary. Because I was standing shoulder to shoulder with those reactionaries, I'm in a unique position to be able to bring them around. We'll see what happens.

"All governments lie, but disaster lies in wait for countries whose officials smoke the same hashish they give out." -IF Stone

Guy Tuttle and Ass
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FINALLY CHRIST

Quote:
Dear XXX,

I wanted you to be one of the first to know: on Saturday, I will hold an event in Washington D.C. to thank everyone who has supported my campaign. Over the course of the last 16 months, I have been privileged and touched to witness the incredible dedication and sacrifice of so many people working for our campaign. Every minute you put into helping us win, every dollar you gave to keep up the fight meant more to me than I can ever possibly tell you.

On Saturday, I will extend my congratulations to Senator Obama and my support for his candidacy. This has been a long and hard-fought campaign, but as I have always said, my differences with Senator Obama are small compared to the differences we have with Senator McCain and the Republicans.

I have said throughout the campaign that I would strongly support Senator Obama if he were the Democratic Party's nominee, and I intend to deliver on that promise.

When I decided to run for president, I knew exactly why I was getting into this race: to work hard every day for the millions of Americans who need a voice in the White House.

I made you -- and everyone who supported me -- a promise: to stand up for our shared values and to never back down. I'm going to keep that promise today, tomorrow, and for the rest of my life.

I will be speaking on Saturday about how together we can rally the party behind Senator Obama. The stakes are too high and the task before us too important to do otherwise.

I know as I continue my lifelong work for a stronger America and a better world, I will turn to you for the support, the strength, and the commitment that you have shown me in the past 16 months. And I will always keep faith with the issues and causes that are important to you.

In the past few days, you have shown that support once again with hundreds of thousands of messages to the campaign, and again, I am touched by your thoughtfulness and kindness.

I can never possibly express my gratitude, so let me say simply, thank you.

Sincerely,

Hillary Rodham Clinton

source

Pertti Susilainen
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So Ice, what do you make of Obama's recent speech about foreign policy and, specifically, Israel?

Yogi
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There is no popular vote, cause there is no definitive numbers. There is estimates and lacking tallys all over the place.

The Big Deal

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