Menion
INTL Premium Member
Regular
 Man-Onions
Ballkicks: (+122 / -35)
Posts: 905 (0.141)
Reg. Date: Aug 2003
Location: Tavares, FL
Gender: Male |
Reply 19 of 50 (Originally posted on: 06-22-07 10:56:46 PM)
Edit Post
| Edit History
| Send PM
| Change Title
| Reply w/Quote
| Report Post
| Ignore
| Show All Posts
Quote: Good use of logical argument. It will happen because I say it will happen.
No, that was the conclusion for which the premises were already given.
If we allow immigrants to enter the country unchequed, they will continue to tax public systems like education and healthcare. As those systems are taxed, financial pressure is applied to the middle classes in the USA. As the pressure continues to build, the middle class will ultimately collapse.
Conclusion: It will happen. That's a logical argument sir.
Yes, yes, I know that there are some assumptions made. I expect that most don't need me to spell them out. It's not a perfect argument because more premises are needed, but the form is valid.
Quote: Then let the standard of living fall. Seriously, what is the big deal with western nations keeping up this mantel? If standards must fall to better integrate this economy and produce the cheapest, best product, why not? If you live in a palatial mansion and one of your workers lives in a dirt shack, why not? People should be allowed to choose what type of life they without the government trying to keep everyone as close as possible. Hey, if you want to scrub toilets the rest of your life, so be it. If you want to be a corporate executive who gets to keep the money he earns, so be it. In the end, its all about the right to fairness.
Sigh...
I don't know how to disagree with you. I've always been of the opinion that American upper classes should pay heavier and heavier taxes and that efforts to close the economic gaps in the country should be made... but I'm not sure a free for all is the right way to do it. Your method would bring about rapid changes starting from the bottom, which isn't where we need to start. Pressure needs to be applied to the wealthy in this country, which means that they need to be forced to support more than what they currently do.
To be realistic, a complete restructuring of income taxes (and budget) would solve the problem, and we would never have to worry about immigration again. Since congress is made up of rich guys, though, that won't happen.
Since we can't rebuild the system to put pressure on the strongest pillars, the only thing we can do is try to take pressure OFF the weaker ones. That would be middle and working classmen. Taking the pressure off of them requires taking pressure of public systems, and immigrants apply pressure to exactly those systems.
I digress a little, but it's worth mentioning.
I now find myself saying that your goal is the correct one, it's just that I think you take the wrong route to get there.
EDIT:
Another thing that bothers me...
"In order to produce the cheapest, best product..."
In order to produce quality goods at low cost on any reasonable scale is to start off with massive resources.
Think about that for a minute. Allowing universal amnesty to immigrants would mean that median education levels would drop, skilled labor would be replaced by unskilled labor, and the median quality of goods produced in the USA would drop. Keep adding more labor, and the quality of the products continues to drop.
So the question for you is, do you intend to create a world in which everyone is equal?
Or do you intend to create a world in which the best goods are produced at the lowest cost?
I can't see how both of those goals can be met anywhere in the near future, one must come exclusive of the other.
Abridged version:
There aren't enough toilet seats for everyone, vissario. If you keep bringing in people to scrub them, eventually we're gonna run out of toilets.
Ok, that's good to know...
"To err is human, but to really foul things up you need a computer." --Paul Ehrlich
"I wish Stanley Baldwin no ill, but it would have been much better if he had never lived" -- Winston Churchill
"I love California, I practically grew up in Phoenix." -- The Infamous Mr. Dan Quayle
This reply was last edited on 06-22-07 11:12:46 PM by Menion.
|